I can’t see how any current American of Indian descent would conclude that importing more of his co-ethnics would be in his best interest. It’s empirically and logically flawed at this point. He’d better pull the ladder up behind him.
Is it just stupidity about understanding his situation?
Vivek’s tweet is one of the dumbest things I’ve ever read. Now 112 million people think he’s a joke.
Something similar to Golden rule perhaps? Like I would find it odd to oppose immigration, if my own immigrant parent benefited from it and is the reason I am here.
Magna Carta -level. That's why The Tortuga Society society is so important: mentoring the young lieutenants coming up through the ranks of the new American Gentry -- by jobstacking WFH corp gigs. Why is Musk so against the tech American Gentry? Why is Trump sounding like a doofus about it? It's insulting. By extension, are they implying the Gentry should only work for US War Dept contractors -- 'cuz there's the 'security clearance' requirement that requires 'US citizenship'?
As an aside, I wonder if the unhinged meltdown by Musk is partly a side-effect from taking Ozempic and Mounjaro for weight loss; maybe further exasperated by his previous brain-damage from childhood vaccines. Still, no excuse.
If we look at the rough demographic profile of the left and right today, they can largely be generalized as
- Left wing elites: college educated bureaucrats who subscribe to woke luxury beliefs acquired from their college days and generally have very little skin in the game in their jobs
(e.g. college professors/administrators, big tech managers, HR departments everywhere, government employees)
- Left wing masses: people who work in very low agency jobs or who want to not work at all and depend on the generosity of the bureaucracies, people who go into debt for liberal arts degrees from non-elite schools
(e.g. the urban underclass, welfare dependents, entry level workers in bureaucracies, baristas with loads of student debts)
- Right wing elites: merchant elites who have a lot of skin in the game and are grounded in economic realities instead of decadent luxury beliefs or the politics of budget allocations
(e.g. business owners and investors, which in the context of tech would be VCs, founders, and founder aspirants)
- Right wing masses: working class people who still take pride in their work or their identity
(e.g. plumbers, welders, carpenters, etc.)
Low-skill illegal immigration competes with right wing masses a lot more than left wing masses, because the undocumented typically do not become entry level workers in bureaucracies or compete for welfare payments, but they do provide downward wage pressure on commoditized blue-collar work. On top of that, since their very presence here depends on the leniency of the left wing elite, they tend to be left leaning despite being from socially conservative backgrounds, and I don’t see that changing any time soon
H1B immigration, on the other hand, hurts left wing elites much more than right wing elites. They are also much less likely to suffer from woke luxury beliefs permeating on liberal college campuses. Not only do they lean socially conservative due to being from more socially conservative cultures, but they are also likely to be more economically conservative since they are used to being elites in their home countries and tend to look down on unproductive people. Having gone through the cutthroat immigration filters, they despise affirmative action and racial/gender-based hiring quotas more than most native-born whites. The only reason for these people to lean left would be if they perceive the right as being hostile towards them.
If people like Elon and Vivek can frame the narratives on the right correctly, there is a once-in-a-generation opportunity to swing most high skill immigrants and 2nd/3rd gen Asians into a right-leaning voting block. And displacing socially liberal bureaucrats with socially conservative ones would be a bonus
I don't even live in America but I've been working remotely as a software engineer for American companies for over 15 years - way before remote work was really common and when most people doing the same were just code monkeys in some offshore outsourcing cubicle farm.
I got into this situation by being really good at what I do and by going all-out to adapt myself to American culture and work ethics. Heck, I take this so seriously that I work on my local holidays and observe the American ones, I even have been hosting a thanksgiving dinner for my family for years.
I could have migrated as an H-1B several times, but I have always refused, because my dollars go a lot further here, even if I make as much and even a bit over American average salaries for what I do if you cut outliers like FAANG salaries. But no, I enjoy living the american culture peripherically, but I am not an American, I was not cut to be an immigrant and neither I think my family could adapt themselves.
I've built myself a niche that I've carefully cultivated over the years, and the last thing I want is for the American tech job market to be flooded by hordes of H-1B pajeets or by hordes of late-coming remote workers from the third world who are happy to work for $40/hour or even less.
Damn good article. I work with Indians constantly and the A-tier/D-tier divide is super real. As near as I can tell the only mid Indians go into stand-up comedy.
Just remember, boys. Old-School Chud racism *lost*.
"Racism" defined as looking out for the interests of your own people, without delusions of Eternal Superiority, and able to make agreements with other peoples, is the only way forward.
I don't know if the term "race realism" has any mileage left, but that's what I've always understood it to mean.
I’ve always said cutting immigration means there’s more good things to go around for the people who are let in and given the chance to help to contribute to the rest of us.
As an adamant racist and judeo-critical, and anti-semitic guy, Rajeev and many such Indians are very good. Purge the rest, so we can enjoy them and ourselves!
> Obviously Elon had a sizeable impact on the last election, but his fans should keep in mind that tech workers have been turning against the Left more generally for a hell of a lot longer than Musk has been the GOP’s chief power broker.
So, I get the impression that I'm on the order of ~20 years older than you are. Which doesn't mean my opinions are correct because I'm older, just that I may have a longer trendline base than you do. (Hell, if anything, I'm significantly *less* sure of my positions now than I was 20 or 30 years ago...) And my observation is that the tech worker set has been going Left for a lot longer than any of them have been coming back Right.
This has little to do with H-1Bs, and is more of a nitpick about this one bit. But I used to be able to have conversations with coworkers about politics, and not get just unhinged screeching in return, whereas these days... not so much. OK, *today specifically* I can, but that's because I work in a *very* outlying portion of the field. For the most part, flailing leftards don't end up in the nuclear weapons industry. But in just about any other portion of the Computer Jock Life, it's been a continuous and increasingly rapid slide to the hard, hard left. And I'm not sure that people moving out of leftist shitholes is a sign that they're moving right, so much as them not realizing that they were the cause of the problems they're seeking to avoid in the first place. Y'know, like locusts. ;)
Wouldn't it be that westerner's in general are too expensive as labor cost in competitive markets and CEOs have no choice? I'm afraid it's all moving up the food chain, barring Vivek R.'s stupid and insulting reasoning. They either export the jobs or import workers at cheaper prices. They favor the latter for a number of reasons. Cold, hard logic of the market.
Charles McMillion of MGB Information Services (source, CNSNews, Buchanan, Feb. 17, 2009):
"From Jan. 31, 2001, through Jan. 31, 2009, 4.4 million manufacturing jobs, 26 percent of all of the manufacturing jobs in the United States, disappeared.
"Semiconductors and electronic component producers lost 42 percent of their jobs. Communications equipment producers lost 48 percent of their jobs. Textile and apparel producers lost, respectively, 63 percent and 61 percent of their jobs. As a source of American jobs, manufacturing, for the first time in our history, fell below health care and education in 2001, below retail sales in 2002, below local government in 2006, below leisure and hospitality, i.e., restaurants and bars, in 2008."
This is the soap I've been using for the past year, in case anyone wants to smell as good as I do.
https://a.co/d/fqVabP6
no homo
I can’t see how any current American of Indian descent would conclude that importing more of his co-ethnics would be in his best interest. It’s empirically and logically flawed at this point. He’d better pull the ladder up behind him.
Is it just stupidity about understanding his situation?
Vivek’s tweet is one of the dumbest things I’ve ever read. Now 112 million people think he’s a joke.
Something similar to Golden rule perhaps? Like I would find it odd to oppose immigration, if my own immigrant parent benefited from it and is the reason I am here.
Magna Carta -level. That's why The Tortuga Society society is so important: mentoring the young lieutenants coming up through the ranks of the new American Gentry -- by jobstacking WFH corp gigs. Why is Musk so against the tech American Gentry? Why is Trump sounding like a doofus about it? It's insulting. By extension, are they implying the Gentry should only work for US War Dept contractors -- 'cuz there's the 'security clearance' requirement that requires 'US citizenship'?
As an aside, I wonder if the unhinged meltdown by Musk is partly a side-effect from taking Ozempic and Mounjaro for weight loss; maybe further exasperated by his previous brain-damage from childhood vaccines. Still, no excuse.
Great article, nailed it.
P.S.. I'm glad you enjoyed the smell of your campy Indian friend
If we look at the rough demographic profile of the left and right today, they can largely be generalized as
- Left wing elites: college educated bureaucrats who subscribe to woke luxury beliefs acquired from their college days and generally have very little skin in the game in their jobs
(e.g. college professors/administrators, big tech managers, HR departments everywhere, government employees)
- Left wing masses: people who work in very low agency jobs or who want to not work at all and depend on the generosity of the bureaucracies, people who go into debt for liberal arts degrees from non-elite schools
(e.g. the urban underclass, welfare dependents, entry level workers in bureaucracies, baristas with loads of student debts)
- Right wing elites: merchant elites who have a lot of skin in the game and are grounded in economic realities instead of decadent luxury beliefs or the politics of budget allocations
(e.g. business owners and investors, which in the context of tech would be VCs, founders, and founder aspirants)
- Right wing masses: working class people who still take pride in their work or their identity
(e.g. plumbers, welders, carpenters, etc.)
Low-skill illegal immigration competes with right wing masses a lot more than left wing masses, because the undocumented typically do not become entry level workers in bureaucracies or compete for welfare payments, but they do provide downward wage pressure on commoditized blue-collar work. On top of that, since their very presence here depends on the leniency of the left wing elite, they tend to be left leaning despite being from socially conservative backgrounds, and I don’t see that changing any time soon
H1B immigration, on the other hand, hurts left wing elites much more than right wing elites. They are also much less likely to suffer from woke luxury beliefs permeating on liberal college campuses. Not only do they lean socially conservative due to being from more socially conservative cultures, but they are also likely to be more economically conservative since they are used to being elites in their home countries and tend to look down on unproductive people. Having gone through the cutthroat immigration filters, they despise affirmative action and racial/gender-based hiring quotas more than most native-born whites. The only reason for these people to lean left would be if they perceive the right as being hostile towards them.
If people like Elon and Vivek can frame the narratives on the right correctly, there is a once-in-a-generation opportunity to swing most high skill immigrants and 2nd/3rd gen Asians into a right-leaning voting block. And displacing socially liberal bureaucrats with socially conservative ones would be a bonus
I don't even live in America but I've been working remotely as a software engineer for American companies for over 15 years - way before remote work was really common and when most people doing the same were just code monkeys in some offshore outsourcing cubicle farm.
I got into this situation by being really good at what I do and by going all-out to adapt myself to American culture and work ethics. Heck, I take this so seriously that I work on my local holidays and observe the American ones, I even have been hosting a thanksgiving dinner for my family for years.
I could have migrated as an H-1B several times, but I have always refused, because my dollars go a lot further here, even if I make as much and even a bit over American average salaries for what I do if you cut outliers like FAANG salaries. But no, I enjoy living the american culture peripherically, but I am not an American, I was not cut to be an immigrant and neither I think my family could adapt themselves.
I've built myself a niche that I've carefully cultivated over the years, and the last thing I want is for the American tech job market to be flooded by hordes of H-1B pajeets or by hordes of late-coming remote workers from the third world who are happy to work for $40/hour or even less.
Damn good article. I work with Indians constantly and the A-tier/D-tier divide is super real. As near as I can tell the only mid Indians go into stand-up comedy.
Just remember, boys. Old-School Chud racism *lost*.
"Racism" defined as looking out for the interests of your own people, without delusions of Eternal Superiority, and able to make agreements with other peoples, is the only way forward.
I don't know if the term "race realism" has any mileage left, but that's what I've always understood it to mean.
I’ve always said cutting immigration means there’s more good things to go around for the people who are let in and given the chance to help to contribute to the rest of us.
As an adamant racist and judeo-critical, and anti-semitic guy, Rajeev and many such Indians are very good. Purge the rest, so we can enjoy them and ourselves!
> Obviously Elon had a sizeable impact on the last election, but his fans should keep in mind that tech workers have been turning against the Left more generally for a hell of a lot longer than Musk has been the GOP’s chief power broker.
So, I get the impression that I'm on the order of ~20 years older than you are. Which doesn't mean my opinions are correct because I'm older, just that I may have a longer trendline base than you do. (Hell, if anything, I'm significantly *less* sure of my positions now than I was 20 or 30 years ago...) And my observation is that the tech worker set has been going Left for a lot longer than any of them have been coming back Right.
This has little to do with H-1Bs, and is more of a nitpick about this one bit. But I used to be able to have conversations with coworkers about politics, and not get just unhinged screeching in return, whereas these days... not so much. OK, *today specifically* I can, but that's because I work in a *very* outlying portion of the field. For the most part, flailing leftards don't end up in the nuclear weapons industry. But in just about any other portion of the Computer Jock Life, it's been a continuous and increasingly rapid slide to the hard, hard left. And I'm not sure that people moving out of leftist shitholes is a sign that they're moving right, so much as them not realizing that they were the cause of the problems they're seeking to avoid in the first place. Y'know, like locusts. ;)
Thanks I just saved for later reading
There are even cases of H1-BS discriminating against Indian immigrants and their descendants. The ethnic nepotism is very exclusive.
Wouldn't it be that westerner's in general are too expensive as labor cost in competitive markets and CEOs have no choice? I'm afraid it's all moving up the food chain, barring Vivek R.'s stupid and insulting reasoning. They either export the jobs or import workers at cheaper prices. They favor the latter for a number of reasons. Cold, hard logic of the market.
Charles McMillion of MGB Information Services (source, CNSNews, Buchanan, Feb. 17, 2009):
"From Jan. 31, 2001, through Jan. 31, 2009, 4.4 million manufacturing jobs, 26 percent of all of the manufacturing jobs in the United States, disappeared.
"Semiconductors and electronic component producers lost 42 percent of their jobs. Communications equipment producers lost 48 percent of their jobs. Textile and apparel producers lost, respectively, 63 percent and 61 percent of their jobs. As a source of American jobs, manufacturing, for the first time in our history, fell below health care and education in 2001, below retail sales in 2002, below local government in 2006, below leisure and hospitality, i.e., restaurants and bars, in 2008."